ARENA

[erotic_dude]

I think Ricardo should cool it now. I understand his statement via Makker and have to ask him why he stayed with PW for so long given his bitterness towards him. Manipulation of human beings is not a PW exclusive. Presumably Ricardo is a much stronger person than some of the models manipulated by PW yet he chose to work with him for a long time.

For me the difference between the PW of Private and Hustler days is as follows:

His initiations of the old days are classics. Gorgeous girls that were enticed into porn. I really don't care how he did it. We got to see gorgeous girls having sex on camera. You have to respect anyone who could fuck Aneta Keys in the ass. And he treated the models with respect. The dates of the casting didn't matter because they were mostly first time models.

Now even though he has his share of real initiations, he lies about supposed "initiations" like Linda Sweet, pretending that the interview took place a year before it actually did. And he does it with models that don't do b/g like Eileen Sue. That interview did not place in 2011, it took place in 2012, after she was already well known.He wants everyone to believe that Every model in this business was discovered by him.

I also know of models that were so turned off by their experience with him that they stopped doing bg.

In his scenes now he now is constantly calling his models whores. You didn''t see this in any of his old castings. there has to be a psychological reason for this. He has no respect now for the models he works with. And seeing him force models to swallow his sperm against their wishes is disgusting and in my view it's borderline rape.

So now I really don't bother watching his work. It's not what I enjoy watching. I have a choice and I excercise it. But I am a great fan of EBI and seeing PW constantly peddle his lies became unbearable.

[paroxysmia]

In his scenes now he now is constantly calling his models whores. You didn''t see this in any of his old castings. there has to be a psychological reason for this. He has no respect now for the models he works with. And seeing him force models to swallow his sperm against their wishes is disgusting and in my view it's borderline rape.

It's called gonzo. I guess you don't watch clips from Kink...

[radfords]

I also know of models that were so turned off by their experience with him that they stopped doing bg.

Of course PW understands that one way to secure exclusive material is to make it so unpleasant the model will never do it again.

[UDO]

How funny to read all this.

This guy Ricardo had arguments here not only with Pierre Woodman but also with Cayenne Klein and other people here. But now, reading the previous posts, he is the beautiful little angel chased by big devil PW...

The previous post is just a good subject of how to put someone in the mud.

If you a are porn casting agent. You are not handsome, you have to fuck a girl in the ass just 2, 3 or 4 hours after your 1st meeting you can't just talk to her about last movie she saw, flowers she likes and the beauty of her dress. It's obvious, if the girl is worth it, that you has to make her dream, make her "see" what she can get by making the big step. You can call it manipulation but it's just what everybody does in a commercial world. If you have to sell jewellery, dresses, shoes, cars, houses, whatever, you do the same : make the person dream.
You talk about hypnosis ? Then if this was true PW would have been in jail since a long time ago because money or not some girls would have went to the police. And it seems he is not the one who has been in jail... (I don't know why Ricardo has been in jail and I have no appreciation about that).
Once again I have nothing to see with Pierre Woodman, I don't know him, I was member of his site for 2 months because I like Angel Hott a lot but I don't like anal and all hardcore stuff, so his productions are not for me. Believe me or not.
Is it me or many girls had become pornstars after working with Pierre Woodman ? Too many to name. But you just focus on putting the guy like a manipulator.
By the way, if Pierre Woodman is a devil, how does others work ? When you are a porn casting director do behave like an angel ? Do you tell the girl : "[i]Ok, listen. We will fuck you has much as we can. We will get your ass, cover your face with semen, slap your face, slap your bottom, call you "Bitch", call you "Whore", sooner or later your friends and family will know about this, they will see the videos, we will not care about your feelings and more important we will give you a little money because you are unkown. Maybe you will become a pornstar, but that's just maximum 3 girls by year and only then you will earn a lot of money. If you don't become a porn star you will go back to your boring job, hoping for many years not to be recognize in the street, hoping your boyfriend will never know about this. Are you ok with that Honeybunny ?[/i]"

This thing ARENA, shows the dark side of some people, only interested in stupid fights. That's not the subject of this forum. This is lame.
By the way, between the Ricardo/Pierre Woodman fight, I just don't care who is right and who is wrong. Who is the lier and who is not. Who is the good or the bad guy : THE TWO OF YOU HAVE GONE TOO FAR.

Nobody is devil, even Pierre is a gentle guy, only the pornworld becomed poor, and as you mentioned in your last sentence some people are going too far in they're actions, only to keep theyre financial status, and image alive.
The time I was met Woodman, he was much more cool, and everybody could forgive his dictatorial behaviour, his addiction on to have a totalitarian control on people working with him, etc.
That time, when he was doing every second, or third month a big production, could givet to a model the same amount of works he give to a model in 1-2 years theese days, when he was not only let the models agents to send theyre models to work for others, but sometime he was helping with some contacts. That time, up to early 2000, he did 2-3 tropical productions, models had the chance to travel in places many east european people can't even dream about. Not to mention, he could permit himself to pay them double, or triple more than today.
Girls did'nt were happy to get fucked by the master before every scene, or just by fun, but having a nice life, and being happy cuz of other reasons, this was'nt something bad for them as it can look for an outsider.
But things got changed in time, and all this dream life disappeared. Of course this is'nt the fault of Woodman, and all industry changed, and had to accomodate at new conditions in all terms.
The adult model work becomed a cheap one in all terms, and verry close to the prostitute one.
Since in 2004 as agent, I could say to my models to be proud they're models, even if they fuck sometime in movies, and get paid for it, today they compete same as whores to can get enough work, or to can act in big budget movie, when they have the chance. 10 years ago the model was respected, they were fucking only on the stage when doing the scene, and all the crue treat them nice, and was just happy to can get close to a nice model, talk to them, have some fun with at the end of production when everybody was celebrating in a party the work they have done. Today the model is treated most of the cases as a whore, from the moment she arrive at the location, getting sexual offerts even from outsiders, like for example the owner of the rented location for that day, not to mention the rest of the crue in case, driver, lightman, production assistant, stand photographer, etc.
By this point of vieuw Woodman's production is a better one, because he is keeping everything, and everybody under his control, people around of him don't abuse, only him
Same was with Viv Thomas, whom when did production abroad, he was even think on separate the male models from females for night time in hotels. They never had the rooms in hotels too much close, and his one was between they're, jumping out from bed at any moment in the night when was hear some noises to control the situation himself So models were fresh, and excited to work next day, as it had to be. But Viv did'nt fucked the models before his performers had to stick they're dick into them, with the pretext that model need to be prepared for the work.
And because we are at this point, yes some models at the beginning they really need to be prepared, but mostly psichologically, than as Pierre does. What this fuckin ass preparation count when model is stressed ? Nothing. It's just worst. If the model is excited, and ready to get fucked in the ass by a handsome Mike Angelo, the worst is if before she have to accept to get fucked a bit by Pierre. It is more important to women to be menthally prepared for sex than phisically.
So I liked how Pierre handled his production, and I agreed with his ideea on taking under control everything. But I did'nt agreed on getting too much far, and controlling even the private life of models, coworkers.
And the worst is that for theese days he is more concentrated on to control than on to produce a nice quality content.
Today he choosed to perform, because like this he can fuck the girls.So Juliana Grandi, and Foxi Di, have to understand why Pierre is saying he's not interrested to do another scene with Foxi, even if his members are crazy for it.... Pierre does'nt want to suffer, by taking on camera how others are fucking this litle hottie, without he could fuck her. So better no. It's obvious.
So why I was working with Pierre, when he was so bad with me ?
First of all I did'nt had many chances, and I believed, was hope, he really want to help me get back, as he acted like I was thinking he realised what a big damage he caused to me when reporting my model was working as escort in Paris, and later continuing his troublemaker activity, and pushing me more deep in the shit he maded.
Secondly I wanted to keep him close until I end with this court trial of mine. You know, sometime it's better to keep your enemy close...He goes down the hill, I no longer have what to lose, from here my way lead up to the hill.
And at the end, yes I think we should treat models as adults, being honest with them and telling them the truth.If we are honest with them, they can't expect later more than we offered to them. And same with employers. We don't have to promise them 2000 Eu sallary for start whom if everything goes well can grow up to 4-5000 in a year, but for sure at 10000 in 3 years, when paying only around 350+ giving accomodation, sometime food at the restaurant when working, possibility to have fun with the boss, have a juice, coffee, play some sports ( like an escort ), the rest just stay at home and still work to can have a nice restaurant dinner with the boss friends next day.But your salary never will be more, even you boss is succesful, cuz he want to keep you like this, but at the same time he promote himself by telling to others how gentle he is when giving 4000 Euro salary to his employed,big nice flat as accomodation, and takes him to Bucharest, and Berlin.
Sorry, but I felt better when I could say to my client if my model was'nt at her top performance in a scene to not pay me the agent fee, and to have my 4000 Eu/month in my pocket, spending it as I wanted, drinking a beer if I felt like that, not lemonade, and I could permit myself to travel for 2 weeks in Spain at the beach, or for skiing somewhere in mountains.

[UDO]

I also know of models that were so turned off by their experience with him that they stopped doing bg.Of course PW understands that one way to secure exclusive material is to make it so unpleasant the model will never do it again.

Very good point
This is a strategy of his. And this is what makes the adult model agents become pimps, recruiting models will soon become prostitutes.

[Philanderer81]

I also know of models that were so turned off by their experience with him that they stopped doing bg.

Of course PW understands that one way to secure exclusive material is to make it so unpleasant the model will never do it again.

LULZ

[makker]

Anyway, the same actors PW uses turn out much hotter and better scenes with Legalporno/Sineplex. That company is his biggest competitor so he hates it.

[Am0rIn0]

I also know of models that were so turned off by their experience with him that they stopped doing bg.

Of course PW understands that one way to secure exclusive material is to make it so unpleasant the model will never do it again.

thats the point! but it is a general problem in porn biz these days, not only followed by pw.

czechcasting for example does the same, they push models as much as possible to get a b/g scene and than drop her, hide them from other productions and are interested in that she leaves biz or at least stops b/g, the goal are exclusive scenes.

producers like pw want everything exclusive thats why the try to keep models away from their main competitors, in his case LP and rocco like the recent examples show. they sharpen the competitions in this biz even more to a point where the models and consumers start to become the victims and losers. they pay with less jobs and less scenes.

it is strange that following top models quit b/g or even biz completely shortly after working with pw:
- holly anderson
- delfine
- jenny apach
- rose delight
- angel hott
- ashley stillar
...

but the main problem are also the agents who dont realize this and burn their talents with such producers. normally it should be like this: producers book models for a shooting and than finish. not talking or pushing them out of biz to have exclusive material.

those people harm porn biz and are reason that it is going down even faster, because without good models willing to shoot a lot this biz is nothing!

[alpha68]

In his scenes now he now is constantly calling his models whores. You didn''t see this in any of his old castings. there has to be a psychological reason for this. He has no respect now for the models he works with. And seeing him force models to swallow his sperm against their wishes is disgusting and in my view it's borderline rape.

It's called gonzo. I guess you don't watch clips from Kink...

Depends how you look at it, I see some of his actions as sick humiliation and it's one of the many reasons I'm tired of Woodman.

[makker]

I think PW's tactics and some other companies to have exclusives poison the porn market and gives bad experiences for girls who could drop out, leaving porn consumers with less and less good scenes. For example in Woodman's case, there was a really cute Russian blonde called Freshblonde who disappeared right after PW's casting.

In Angel Hott's case, she completely severed contact with him. She probably didn't like him that much at all, just like Cayenne.

I wonder if in the USA these kinds of practices are also common.

[cindyloumerican]

I think PW's tactics and some other companies to have exclusives poison the porn market and gives bad experiences for girls who could drop out, leaving porn consumers with less and less good scenes. For example in Woodman's case, there was a really cute Russian blonde called Freshblonde who disappeared right after PW's casting.

In Angel Hott's case, she completely severed contact with him. She probably didn't like him that much at all, just like Cayenne.

I wonder if in the USA these kinds of practices are also common.

If pierre tried this initiation and behaviour in the USA he will go to jail so fast he won't know what hit him. He will also be anally raped in jail by phil. The pornstar ,even amatuer are treated humanely here. We had a pornstar name max with a cowboy hat that was doing this type of behavior to the girls. Even though it was scripted he went to jail. As smart as pierre is trying to work around the law in the US they will find a way for him to go to jail. I guarantee it. Some of the things pierre does with the girl is almost sadistic.

[Am0rIn0]

now that you guys mention it, in the USA the market is quite free, every model can be booked by every producer at an agency. the only kinded of exclusive contracts who make sense is between model and agency, so she will have also a better management.

just think about cuties like dillon harper, in europe she would be already exclusive with a production. also when i think about nekane, who was exclusive with cumlouder, she just did a few poor scenes and is now retired. looks like every b/g model in europe who is slim has pretty face and C-cups becomes exclusive soon.

[makker]

now that you guys mention it, in the USA the market is quite free, every model can be booked by every producer at an agency. the only kinded of exclusive contracts who make sense is between model and agency, so she will have also a better management.

just think about cuties like dillon harper, in europe she would be already exclusive with a production. also when i think about nekane, who was exclusive with cumlouder, she just did a few poor scenes and is now retired. looks like every b/g model in europe who is slim has pretty face and C-cups becomes exclusive soon.

So why is the porn market in Europe not like it is in the USA? Is it because it more matured there?

Anyway, one of the advantages in Europe is that girls are more prepared to do anal, IR and other stuff earlier than in the USA. American girls only do anal when they are several years in their career (after lot of begging ).

You have to give it to PW though, that he managed to do some hot girls anal

[Am0rIn0]

they are way better organized, in europe only hungary has a few well organized agencies, in czech it is just a big mess without any system.

a good manager would give the advice to the models to start with anal only once they are older as it will lenghten their careers, so also here you see USA is much more professional.

in europe no agencies cares about the models and what they do, as they come and go and work with a dozen other agencies at once. than some producers also do their best to make models life harder. normally it should be like that that the models get advice only from agencies but not from producers as most producers follow completely opposite interests (paying as less as possible, getting as much as possible scenes and to keep her exclusive).

[UDO]

I think PW's tactics and some other companies to have exclusives poison the porn market and gives bad experiences for girls who could drop out, leaving porn consumers with less and less good scenes. For example in Woodman's case, there was a really cute Russian blonde called Freshblonde who disappeared right after PW's casting.

In Angel Hott's case, she completely severed contact with him. She probably didn't like him that much at all, just like Cayenne.

I wonder if in the USA these kinds of practices are also common.

If pierre tried this initiation and behaviour in the USA he will go to jail so fast he won't know what hit him. He will also be anally raped in jail. Some of the things he does with the girl is almost sadistic.

Depends how you look at it, I see some of his actions as sick humiliation and it's one of the many reasons I'm tired of Woodman.

It's clear that some of the girls they quit immediately after working with PW. Some they quit even before to try to do porn, just after the intervieuw
But there are different girls. And of course he also treat differently the girls. He does some never released intimate scenes, and of course the rough ones whom are released.Don't forget his gf Sophie Paris is helping him with editing, so he must be rough with girls to not make her jealous
What's really sad he does the casting intervieuw, and after that he makke the sex test with the girl. Next is to decide how, and for what to use the girl, up to how she looks, how she fucked, how smart, or stupid she is, from where he got her (agency he has to take care, pimp whom does'nt care about, etc.), she was already working before or not (and with who? competitor or not ).
But for sure he will do to happen something in one of the first scene he will do with the model what will make her to feel ashamed.Usually girls are making scenes full of shit. So after the scene is done he's promising to the girl will do another scene to be released, and will keep this dirty one in his box. When the girl makes a mistake, and she's doing anal for someone else, he just call her for a private discussion, and explain her she have to make another stronger scene than the one she did for his competitor, or he don't care will publish the dirty one he has in his box
Girls better accept the pain than to hear back about they're scenes when shitting on the floor, or in the bed, believe me
He also use to pee on some of the girls at the end of the scene, when they are taking the shower just like playing with them. But even if he does'nt release theese golden shower moments, the models they remember all what happened, and they never will talk about to others...
He usually do fake cumshot, and ask the girls to do it separately when they're in the bath. So it is a funny moment when the girl realise he's pissing in her mouth, instead of cumming But they forgive him because being paid, and he's promising will not publish theese recorded moments.
Just compare this PW, with the one from 10 years ago, whom was really taking care of models not to be even a bit of shit in his scenes. He had a special assistant for to take care, and wash theyre ass before the scene, in proper way, and sitting with the cleanex in his hand back on the stage watching the shooting and jumping immediately when something get yellow, or brown to wipe off.